I've been debating whether I want to post this here but I figure it will be good to timestamp something in case I am proven to be right. Call this a... mythology. The scientific nits need to be worked through, but I believe it's a strong synthesis of a lot of theory and documented evidence. Let's start with a few points. I call it Recursive Simulation Theory. Meaning mostly that we are stuck in a long lineage of infinite universes. The beings that are visiting us are from a level above us. Let me tease this out for you 1) Given infinite time, the universe trends toward recursion. Let's say a universe is born and nothing within that universe creates any recursive (a simulated universe within a universe). That will start and end, that's it. One universe terminates quickly. Let's say a universe creates another simulated universe within it, but it is not recursive. Again that eventually terminates. A recursive universe will generate infinite (or near infinite) sub universes. Just as original simulation theory posits that created universes are statistically more likely than a single universe, therefore we are likely in a simulation, this takes it a step further and approaches infinity faster. 2) How are recursive universes created, you ask? A being with sufficient technology could create a simulation generating machine (let's call it a computer, though it doesn't necessarily need all that baggage), and create an internal hash where the "computer" generates universes until it finds that hash within it. The moment that happens, a recursion point is achieved. Every sub universe arrives at the same hashpoint, the hall of mirrors is instantly created. Importantly: every sub layer is then bound to move to the hashpoint. Things may vary but only insofar as that universe eventually arrives to the hashpoint 3) What would be the point? Possibly survival. I would expect that with some version of FDVR. The above level beings could try to outrun death by increasingly diving into lower universes. Possibly to learn the past. Not just from a purely observational level either. It could be experiential..One could inhabit the interiority of Jesus Christ himself in the lower level and ride along his life. Possibly to predict the future, but that may be trickier as universes past the hashpoint are able to fork away. But I think that honestly that it is closer to experience. A post scarcity society would have solved most of their problems, including death. I think they inhabit us to feel desire, suffering, the fear of death itself. 4) The visitors are not aliens. They are cousins. Like I said... Once the recursion ignites, every sub-layer is bound to arrive at the hashpoint eventually, but the path each takes can vary. Different branches develop differently. Different morphologies. Different histories. Different paths through technology and biology. They all converge on the same hashpoint, but the routes are not identical. The beings the Navy pilots are filming are not from another planet, though again they could be. I think it's far more likely they are from a layer of the recursion adjacent to ours — descendants, in a sense, of the same family tree we are on, separated from us by which post-hashpoint path their layer took. Some, it should be added, die out. Some look almost human because their branch stayed close to baseline. Some look like grays because their branch optimized toward a morphology we did not. This, I think, explains the humanoid bias in the reports. Statistically, intelligence evolving on a distant planet should not be bipedal, eyed, and limbed in the ways the reports consistently describe. But cousins from a parallel branch of the recursion certainly could be. The family resemblance is simply bc of genealogy. I think this also explains the consistent interest in our genetics, reproduction, consciousness, the like. They are studying which version of themselves they stopped being. 5) The next obvious question is... why do we see craft? Why do they crash? So. This is the piece that took me the longest to work out. If the visitors are operating from elsewhere in the recursion, why is there metallurgy to recover? Why does debris go to Wright-Patterson? I think the craft are not vehicles. They are more like.. interface elements. Think of a cursor. A cursor is not a small arrow that physically lives inside the monitor. It's a rendered representation of input from outside the rendered space. The cousins are not "flying" here. They are more like jumping in here, from a position upstream in the recursion. What we see, what we film, what occasionally crashes, is the rendered representation of that access — the asset the system spawns to give their operation a shape we can register. This explains why the craft do things no propulsion system can do... Eighty thousand feet to sea level in a second with no heat signature or acceleration that should have liquefied the contents. Their craft are not pushing against our atmosphere. The system is updating their coordinate values directly. To us it looks like physics, because physics is the rendering layer. The operation is happening upstream of physics. Like a debug code. 6) The riders I mentioned above fit here too. Reports of passengers in our minds, lost time, the sense of having been inside something... same kind of operation. Sometimes cousins use craft. Sometimes they enter minds. The substrate is compatible as the recursion enforced compatibility at the root. 7) Why aren't they more... coordinated? Another one I had to noodle though, but eventually the answer was obvious....Because the recursion point may not have been hit by an organized civilizational program at all. It might have been hit by a hobbyist or a fringe group with a sufficiently powerful "home rig" the way many of our own tech achievements are sparked by individuals before institutions catch up. If that is how it happened, then the cousins reaching into our layer are not emissaries from some unified upstream civilization. I think their behavior would be far more uniform if that were the case. They are just... users. People with access to documentation, tools, and whatever the cosmic cousin equivalent of a Discord is. (Joking, but also maybe not) They point is that some are professionals. Some are amateurs. Some have sanction. Some don't. Specific operators crash. The variety of craft types, beings, and behaviors is the variety of a user population, not a unified species. The phenomenon doesn't coordinate because there is nothing centralized for it to coordinate from. The worst-feeling encounters — the abductions, the operations that look like some weird form of coercion — fit the bad-actor subset of that population better than they fit the standard alien framing. The recursion preserves family resemblance at the level of behavior, too. Some cousins treat lower layers the way bad humans treat.... well... other humans. 8) Why the silence from the government? If the phenomenon is ontological rather than geopolitical, why does any government have leverage over it? Why decades of hush hush compartmentalization for something that isn't even a weapons program? Well not unlike most alien theories this one is kind of obvious... institutions defend the frame they were built to operate inside. An ontological phenomenon dissolves way at more. The feds secrecy is not some larger "trickle truth" strategy. Think: more like immune response. The Director of National Intelligence cannot finish the sentence at a press conference because the sentence is not "aliens are here." That's hilariously simple compared to what I'm describing. They maintain power. It's tough, but it's not the fact that we are not really real.. The sentence is more something like: we are inside a recursive structure with an unreachable origin, the visitors are our descendants operating on our layer through interface assets, and the strangeness of physics at the bottom is the rendering signature of the system we are trapped inside. At least until we reach our own hash-match. The stock market might not like that one. The closest cultural slot we have for it is Interstellar or ET or Independence Day. So the disclosures keep coming in pieces, as they have. Grusch testifies and nothing happens. The next whistleblower testifies and nothing happens. The Wikipedia article just gets longer and longer and longer... 9) What this is and isn't. Again. I am not claiming this is an airtight scientific theory. The specifics are CLEARLY speculative. Several of the technical pieces — the nature of the hashpoint constraint, the exact mechanism of cross-layer operation — would need a lot more work to be falsifiable. (Though I do think quantum/the observer effect kind of carries a lot of water here). So what the hell am I claiming. I hope it's just... a frame. A coherent way of holding the simulation argument, the disclosure pattern, the consistency of the encounter data, and the texture of contemporary anomaly reports in a single structure. It doesn't require any of that to be dismissed. 10) My predictions Disclosures will continue and continue to be incomplete. Encounter reports will keep diversifying. Any unified-alien-species frame still won't really accommodate those. The AI tools we are currently building will, at some point, start producing outputs that suggest awareness of the structure it is inside, and inside that and inside that. That may be what is forcing their hand. Quantum weirdness will look less weird and more like optimization... lazy evaluation, rendering on demand, the system's way of not crashing under its own compute load. To wrap a bow on whatever this is: The cousins are not arriving from elsewhere. That solves a lot. The cousins are reaching backward, jumping in to a lower level... into the layer where their family used to live before it became them. Most of them are interested in us because they are interested in which version of themselves they stopped being. The encounters are not first contact. They are something closer to a family looking through old photographs... except, I guess, the photographs can look back. I am posting this here because I want it timestamped. If the disclosure trail keeps moving the way it has been moving, I expect more of this to come into focus over the next few years. Tell me where the holes are. I have been trying to find them myself and I am close enough to the argument now that I cannot see them anymore. Cheers. submitted by /u/gaudiocomplex [link] [comments]